Hot Yoga Pose Forums > Dandayamana Biphatkapada Paschimottanasana
Guillotine sounds like a very Chinese Torture version of sanskrit.... lol. So I never knew what :pigeon toed"was before this pose... I thought it was turning my toes inward ever so slightly and not as dramatic as it is. I love the focus I get from this pose. I usually laser beam my eyes to one spot on the mat.
AlexandriaS
I really got a lot out of reading about this pose and learned several new "tricks." Sometimes, I can feel my back rounding even gradually and my hips losing the lift. If I imagine my elbows and shoulders pulling up and separating from my chest, my back maintains its stretch. I also read that if the back rounds, reengage the pull by rebending the legs a little.
Should we make a mid-pose adjustment if the forehead does touch by walking the feet a bit closer together?
Mallory Maier
That's a good question, Aimee! I'd like to know that as well.
I find that if I give a nice and graceful swan dive my back and alignment are better poised for the position on the mat. I love rocking and shaking things loose a bit. And the grip under the feet is key.
I also like to sometimes meditate on all the threads of my towel, thinking that each one represents a blessing in my life, or a benefit from this yoga practice.... That way I'm focusing my gaze on the mat, rather than slowly creeping backwards to the back wall.
Melina
Wow thats beautiful Melina! I have heard about students finding characters on our ceiling in Savasana (although you should be looking down the midline of your own body and past your big toes to get more of those neck bones to the mat!) but counting the threads of your towel as a blessing or benefit from this pose - beautiful.
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
Aimee, I would not adjust the feet inward in the midst of the pose; enjoy the forehead to the mat and begin pulling the forehead to the mat between the feet, while in the pose. For the second set, close up your step for more challenge.
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
With elbows to my shins, my legs are quite bent. Yet it feels as though I am finally doing the pose 'more' correctly.
KimA
Wow have I changed my opinion of this pose 180!
I have an intense hamstring pain these days - which I am beginning to think is from misalignment, but that's for another day's story. What I mean to talk about it…I've been pigeon-toeing in for Dandayamana Bipaktapada Paschimottanasana since forever ago, and the other day I learned that I definitely should not.
But I don't have sciatica.
I asked my partner, J, what he thinks about me not pigeon-toeing in even though I don't have sciatica - "well," he said, "severe hamstring pain is a sciatica symptom…and you have a piriformis impingement, which means…the piriformis is pinching down on the sciatic nerve, causing (or partly causing) this issue."
Ah…now I get it. That's why I always hated this pose. It hurt my hamstring SO BAD because I a) pigeon-toed in and b) did not bend my knees at all, thinking this was the correct way to set-up. Man I was wrong! I felt so much better and so much more aware of what the pose is asking me to do this morning in class when I swan dived in on un-pigeon-toed feet and bent knees. My body had lots to thank me for afterwards!
Now I get to work back toward pigeon-toeing in and pulling my legs straight once my hamstring pain goes away.
Grace
I love the Swan Dive. It is such a graceful pose strengthening your back muscles and stretches your hamstrings. It is really nice to dive in and hang for a minute.... Then you lengthen your spine. It is such a great feeling when you find an extra inch. My forehead will touch the floor. I am getting there.
Alfia
In this pose i focus on keeping my back straight for i DO NOT want to end up with the kyphotic curvature of my upper back in my old age! My knees are bend and my forehead does not touch the floor but i can still feel a stretch throughout my spine to my tailbone.
When i pull my elbows to my shins, I have to be conscience to keep my shoulders away from my ears. If im not focused i can immediately feel the tension in my neck and upper back and that cues me to relax the shoulders.
TinaA
This week I plan on letting the tension that comes in the back of my knees that its okay to leave, that is it no longer welcome and go ahead release allowing for a more beautiful relaxed pose.
Becky
I read through the thread above, and I found what Grace wrote rather interesting. I too get that same kind of pain, and I have been pigeon-toeing in much less lately. I was reluctant because I do not have diagnosed sciatica, but I had an intense pain in my hamstrings and hips. I have gotten a much better stretch in my lower back and hamstring keeping my feet straight, and I found that I can straighten my legs and pull my arms to my shins without pain. I also get a much better stretch when I pull my hips up towards the ceiling. It helps to envision pulling my chest to the mat to flatten my back in this stretch.
Brittany Yard
Good awareness Brittany.
As we say, pain is never a place you want go, much less hang out.
Diagnosed or not, sciatic nerve tenderness is not something you want to exacerbate especially since it runs through many parts of your lower body. Fortunately we have script advice to keep the toes pointed straight ahead and not twist the nerve.
That subtle moment of envisioning the chest to the mat lengthens the lower back and gives you more stretch from those otherwise-flattened inches hiding in the lower spine, without pulling on the hamstrings or sciatic nerve.
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
Some days I feel like doing Guillotine and some not so much. I really depends on who warm the room is. Lately, I haven't felt like going for it. It's also easier to do in the 90 min class, but sometimes I'm ready to go for it in 60 min. Either way, I love this pose. Probably the easiest for me.
Dani
I love this pose. I feel like it really lets me release my lower back and stretch out. I also really love shaking my head yes and no in ragdoll. It feels like such a tension release that I just don't get at all during the day. I have no idea how far my head is from the mat, but it hasn't touched yet. It will get there! For now, I'm loving the feeling in my head/ neck and lower back.
Chrissy Graziano
I also love this pose. I have been able to straighten my legs in this post only over the last month or so. I can really feel my hamstrings outside of class since straightening my legs in this pose and many others. The feeling is of the muscles being awakened and I love the feeling of all the supporting muscles in my body. I think I am getting closer to reaching my head to the mat but I am not there yet.
Lisa O'Rourke
This truly is a very relaxing pose - from the graceful swan dive that elongates your back to the rag doll that releases the neck and allows a rounding at the joints, to that moment when the forehead touches and your lower back lengthens and you can almost feel that with one more stretch your chest will be on the ground. Dani, Chrissy and Lisa these are all good moments that you describe. If you're looking for that forehead to mat touchdown, keep rolling forward into the balls of the feet and keep stretching from the breastbone...it is the "growing of more inches from your spine" that really gets the forehead to the mat.
I agree about Guillotine, Dani...some days I just love to luxuriate in a wide-legged stance with my forehead resting on the mat.
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
Rhonda, I’d be interested in trying Guillotine! Since Dandayamana Biphatkapada paschimottanasana is such a pull on the inner thighs which can be limiting in mobility, I wonder how different it would be trying this with the bendy spine I have. Hmmmm May have to experiment. But I can see how the relaxing swan dive and gentle pull of this pose can be much more relaxing than the bound version. I feel that both will have their benefits and I am excited to try this version. My only question would be, if this cues are to “pull the breast bone to the mat” to maintain the straight flat spine, how would we maintain that looming through the legs, I’d think the looking through would round it?
Stephanie
Not at all, Stephanie: you are still pulling with the breastbone and flattening the spine not rounding it, only with this deeper range of stretch. The focus isnt between your legs but up your own spine, as you continue pulling but not on the heels - the hands are now clasped behind your middle back. Remind me to show you a photo!
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
My initial focus for this pose is in swan dive. I have to concentrate on pulling my shoulders apart, stretching my arms wide. Then I can feel a beautiful pull in my thoracic spine as well as my hips and low back.
I have to be conscience to keep my shoulders away from my ears, when I pull my elbows to my shins. If I don’t pay attention to relaxing my shoulders I feel the tension in my neck and upper back.
Taking the inhale before pulling is key in making me focus on flattening my thoracic spine befor I pull. I also find pulling my thighs together isometricly really helps keep me grounded so I feel strong when I pull.
Jeanne
Of course the set up for me is the key for this pose, like Jeanne mentioned the swan dive froward keeps my chest forward to keep my gaze down to my mat. In the early part of my practice I would look back between my legs which cause tension in my neck but remembering to look forward and pulling the forehead to the floor it helps to keep my spine straight. Also as Brittany and grace mentioned regarding the pain in their legs, I also have right sciatic pain. I’ve recently tried to adjust my feet so I can feel a slight stretch in my gluteal muscles to help open up the area and when I release get extra blood flow to the gluteal nerves.
maria
The isometric move of the thighs is an interesting experience Jeanne - I will try this! And Maria, good tip for the sciatic nerve pain...we often tell people to keep a slight bend in the knees during this pose but I like your take better! What is the adjustment you make to your feet to open this area?
Rhonda Uretzky, E-RYT
The "pigeon-toe unless you have sciatica instruction" seems to be one that resonates with many people! I always have thought I'm one of the oddballs out there that has had sciatic issues but I am feeling like this is way more common than I thought. I do see a bit of a mixed message with the script, the book and some of these posts--I no longer have sciatic pain but did for a long time. The script says "pigeon toe in unless you have sciatica", "HAVE" being the word of interest for me. What if you don't have it now but have had it before? Is it better to keep the toes straight with any sciatica history? I think so, because I believe Rhonda said that in a class the other day, but if so I wonder why that is not part of the script because I think it can be easily misunderstood.
Pamela
I too like the swan dive forward. I was in a class this morning in another studio and the teacher told me to straighten out my legs. It did feel good, but I can see that this is not how the book or our script describes the pose. I love the forehead to the mat--not there yet, but seeing some progress.
irenem
During one of the private sessions . Amee pointed out the importance of holding your back straight( i still have a bit of the curve at the lumbar section), which , I understand is the whole point of the pose. I also receive to comment from some of the teachers that I need to lower my head. I think I might be doing it in the effort to keep the space between the eyes aiming at the mat and keeping the neck inline with the rest of the spine. Would need to reconcile those instructions:)
Irina
The first time you get your forehead to the mat you feel like you can leap tall buildings with a single bound. Speaking of which, has anyone tried the bound version of this pose, Guillotine?